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2010 Devils Offseason: UFA Centers by Goals Versus Threshold

Yesterday, I started breaking down the centers who will become unrestricted free agents (UFAs) this summer. The New Jersey Devils will certainly need to fill in spots down the middle; therefore, let's take a closer look at what the market will offer.  

I'm focusing on 23 centers, divided up into three groups based on their ice time last season; yesterday, I found that most of them were pretty good at faceoffs last season.  Should the Devils go to free agency to get a center, they should end up being better (on paper, at least) on draws in 2010-11.  

Today, I've picked out the goals versus threshold (GVT) for each of the 23 centers from Behind the Net.  GVT is a stat developed by Tom Awad, measuring a player's contributions on both offense/goaltending, defense, and shootouts.  All it measures is results, so players who were injured will suffer just due to not playing. Fortunately, all 23 UFA centers have played well more than half of the season, so the suffering is minimized.  For additional context, I've also included their rank among all forwards who played at least one minute this past season. Through GVT, we can get an idea of what type of player they were last season.

Please read on after the jump to see how the 23 centers compare by GVT.  As an aside, if you haven't yet, please check out this post if you're interested in becoming a writer on In Lou We Trust.  One entry per person, please.

Star-divide

The 23 UFA Centers by 2009-10 GVT

Reminder: Yellow = significant minute centers; Purple = secondary min. centers; Light blue = depth min. centers

Ufa_centers_gvt_direct_rip

Now, in addition to GVT, I've also included OIT (offensive ice time) and DIT (defensive ice time) to really clarify what the player's role was when they were on the ice beyond what their contributions were.   For example, take the worst contributor (most damaging?) among the UFA centers, Rickard Wallin. We can say was often on defense more often than not since his DIT (15) was higher than his OIT (11).  With the GVT values, we can also say he was barely above replacement level on defense and just bad on offense.

Most of the UFA centers are above the half of the league's forwards in terms of total GVT (tiebreaker was fewer  games played), 18 to be exact and Richard Park finishing just outside of it.  Moreover, only three players finished below replacement level - and two of them only ended up so low in their short time with their new teams in 2009-10. Therefore, the worst center to pick up on the market appears to be Rickard Wallin.  (Aside: I wonder if Leafs fans truly thought he was awful last season?)

Unsurprisingly, most of the significant minute centers are at the top, with Patrick Marleau being the biggest contributor to his team in offensive, defensive, and total GVT by far.  It's even higher than Ilya Kovalchuk's combined GVT from last season; in terms of GVT, he is the top skater available this summer.  Therefore, he's going to command a ton of money.   Second place in offensive GVT goes to Tomas Plekanec, who also finishes second in total among the UFAs; but second in defensive GVT goes to his teammate Manny Malhotra - further evidence that he could very well be the top checking center on the market this summer.  His total GVT was pretty good, finishing just behind Eric Belanger's Minnesota season.

No, that wasn't a typo.  The raw list from Behind the Net actually breaks up player by their team so players can be listed twice.  Eric Belanger, Olli Jokinen, Matt Cullen, Dominic Moore, and Jeff Halpern were on two teams last season, so their GVT from their respective teams are listed separately.  The ranking of 580 is really 580 listings, so some players were counted twice. Therefore, Belanger's time in Minnesota alone leads all of the secondary minute centers.

I've kept it this way on purpose to highlight two findings: One, only Dominic Moore actually had a better GVT with his new team (Montreal) than his original 09-10 team (Florida).  Again, a traded player will play far fewer games with their new team and so it should be no surprised that they will contribute as much unless they were bad with their old team.   Moore stood in that way, good for him, I guess? Two, looking by OIT and DIT, the traded/acquired players didn't have dramatically different roles with their new teams.  Belanger was on defense more often than offense in both Minnesota and Washington, suggesting he was on checking lines in both places.  Halpern saw limited minutes mostly as a checker as a Bolt and a King; Olli Jokinen was on scoring lines in both Calgary and New York (albiet not scoring a lot); and so forth.

The 23 UFA Centers by GVT - No Separation by Team

Still, it's not very fair to Jokinen, Belanger, Moore, Cullen, and Halpern if we just compare their individual contributions to each team among 18 other centers who only had one team.  Fortunately, GVT is additive, as I done in the Ilya Kovalchuk GVT post.   After adding up the respective GVTs of those 5 centers, here's how they would stack up among the whole UFA center group.  Note: I listed each player's final team from the past season.

2010_ufa_centers_gvt_combined

Since I didn't want to re-rank all the forwards to account for multiple teams and remove duplicate forwards, I've excised that from this chart.   That shouldn't be a problem with comparing UFA center to UFA center, though. 

Here, the breakdown by ice time is little closer together.  Only Rob Niedermayer sticks out like a sore thumb with his relatively low GVT compared to the other significant minute centers.   He was a checking center last season and there's no reason to believe he'll put up more offense.   Olli Jokinen could have finished much lower if it wasn't for his great shootout GVT.

The top man among the secondary minute centers was Eric Belanger. Belanger's total GVT was quite good last season, even out-doing Matthew Lombardi and Olli Jokinen not only in total GVT but also in offensive GVT.   It's more of an impressive feat when you consider Belanger spent more ice time on defense than offense than both of them.  Maybe he could be a second line center?  The offensive GVT wasn't too much less than the productive and seemingly underrated Vinny Prospal.

Speaking of, how come Devils fans aren't talking up Prospal as a second line center?   Perhaps because he's 36?  Perhaps because he's a Ranger?  For a stop-gap solution, it wouldn't be a bad idea.  Definitely a better by GVT and straight up points; he could be likely cheaper to sign than Olli Jokinen, now that I think about it.

As far as the other end of secondary minute centers, Richard Park finished quite low.  OK, his shootout GVT of -0.5 undercut him last season; however, he wouldn't have moved up the list even at replacement level at shootouts.  Speaking of shootouts, Robert Lang is largely propped up by his 1.9 shootout GVT, he really should be lower than where he ranked here.

Speaking of underrated, how about Glen Metropolit?  Not a lot of minutes, but he was the biggest contributor among all depth minute centers for Montreal.  While Nichol's faceoff percentage was great and Jim Slater wasn't a slouch on Atlanta's bottom six, Metropolit's offensive contributions stood out.  If the idea is for the fourth line to contribute some offense, then I think he needs to be considered.   No, his production isn't much different from Moore, Lang, Park, but on-ice contributions go beyond more than just points, and this shows it.

What about defensive centers?  Well, pretty much all of the significant minute centers have had good to really good defensive GVT contributions in this past seasons.  But if the Devils are to target Marleau, Plekanec, etc., you wouldn't use them on a third line with the exception of Rob Niedermayer.  The other five are offensive players, and Marleau and Plekanec on first line players, after all.  However, why re-sign Niedermayer if Malhotra (3.7), Belanger (3.3), or even John Madden (3.3 but just above replacement on offense)?   For a fourth-line caliber centers, the top defensive contributor was Dean McAmmond (1.8) - though Scott Nichol wasn't too much of a drop-off there.

Overall, most of the UFA centers are more defensive than offensive and so finding a third or fourth line center will be easier than a second line center.  Or so it seems by GVT.

Your Turn

Now that you've seen how the UFA centers stack up by GVT, what do you think of them now?  Do you think much more highly of Eric Belanger and Manny Malhotra?  Are you surprised to see Glen Metropolit be listed so highly? Disappointed to see Niedermayer, Park, and Nichol so low?  Please let me know what you think in the comments.

GVT isn't every thing, so the analysis will continue.  Tomorrow, I'll be looking at the even strength on-ice and on-ice impact numbers for these 23 centers.

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The only reason why I don’t see Prospal coming here is mostly because he is a Ranger and seems to love it there. I love Belanger because he fits the system the most. He wouldn’t cost more than 4 million and he would get the job done as the 2nd line or 3rd line center. Metropolit did come off an injury and I see him as the 4th line center. Nichol wouldn’t be a bad pickup either. The bottom line is that the devils need to sign about three centers or maybe 2 and call up a rookie and sign 2 defenseman. The ideal for me would be Belanger and Slater/Nichol and a rookie like Sestito and Foster and Tallinder.

"Hockey is a sport for white men. Basketball is a sport for black men. Golf is a sport for white men dressed like black pimps."- Tiger Woods

by RolliePollieKovy on May 29, 2010 8:50 PM EDT reply actions  

The only reason why I don’t see Prospal coming here is mostly because he is a Ranger and seems to love it there.

That’s a pretty bad reason.

I love Belanger because he fits the system the most.

What system? There’s no new head coach yet. There’s no idea what the system would be for 10-11.

Devils in my heart! Devils in my mind! Devils in my eyes! Devils until I die!
In Lou We Trust - The New Jersey Devils SBN Blog

by John Fischer on May 29, 2010 8:57 PM EDT up reply actions  

You know that what ever coach will come here, Lou will find a defense first one...

"Hockey is a sport for white men. Basketball is a sport for black men. Golf is a sport for white men dressed like black pimps."- Tiger Woods

by RolliePollieKovy on May 29, 2010 9:20 PM EDT up reply actions  

I do?

Devils in my heart! Devils in my mind! Devils in my eyes! Devils until I die!
In Lou We Trust - The New Jersey Devils SBN Blog

by John Fischer on May 29, 2010 9:35 PM EDT up reply actions  

Prospal kinda falls into the same category as Marleau IMO. He’s a center, but he’s played alot of wing though, despite him having a good Faceoff %. And if there’s one reason that Prospal’s cheap: he’s still being paid by the Lightning (via Buyout), and you can’t pay bought out players a certain amount of the bought out contract (I need to read the CBA again)

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by Kevin Sellathamby on May 29, 2010 9:00 PM EDT reply actions  

From the third paragraph of the article:

Fortunately, all 23 UFA centers are .

What’s the missing word(s)? Most times I can extrapolate the meaning, but I’m stumped on this one…

"There are three kinds of lies: lies, damned lies, and statistics." -Mark Twain (?)

by elesias on May 29, 2010 9:08 PM EDT reply actions  

Ooops. My mistake. I’ve completed my thought there.

Devils in my heart! Devils in my mind! Devils in my eyes! Devils until I die!
In Lou We Trust - The New Jersey Devils SBN Blog

by John Fischer on May 29, 2010 9:10 PM EDT up reply actions  

Np, happens to the best of us :)

Thanks.

"There are three kinds of lies: lies, damned lies, and statistics." -Mark Twain (?)

by elesias on May 29, 2010 9:43 PM EDT up reply actions  

I wouldn’t mind Prospal, I would assume the Rangers will try to bring him back next year. I guess Belanger or Malholtra could fill the 2nd line center spot. I’d rather have one of them than moving Elias but I’m still not sold on them.

Guys like Marleau, Plekanec, and Lombardi are probably gonna require long term contracts but I wouldn’t mind either of them if we could sign them for a 2 year deal.

I still think the best option to fill the 2nd line spot would be Koivu. I really wanted him last year and his age doesn’t seem to be a problem as he still produced. I think we could sign him for 2 years and give our young centers time to develop.

Jokinen, Cullen, and Morrison are guys we could bring in for 2 years too. I really don’t want to bring in someone long term though because Henrique and Josefson will probably be ready in the next 2 years.

by C.J. Richey on May 29, 2010 9:45 PM EDT reply actions  

It terms of getting a good 2nd line center for a good price, Matt Lombardi is looking like a nice player. He’s making $2.35 million in salary this year, had a career high in points, a good playoff showing, and he’s 28. In terms of his GVT and the Devils, his offensive GVT would put him 6th behind Langenbrunner, Elias, Zajac, Parise, and Brodeur. His Total GVT would put him 7th (same 6 plus Greene). I know his FO% isn’t as good as some may want (49.67%), but he is a true center and can put up some numbers.

by Matthew Ventolo on May 29, 2010 10:00 PM EDT reply actions  

i generally don’t like GVT as a standalone stat because, if i’m correct about the methodology (and Tom Awad explained it on Puck Prospectus a while ago), it really doesn’t take into account year to year variance in save percentage for and against. so players will yo-yo around their ‘expected’ GVT.

i don’t think prospal would come to new jersey because tortorella and him have a kinski-herzog thing going on – they seem to hate each other but prospal likes playing for tortorella and vice versa. i’d be very surprised if prospal made it to july 1 as a free agent. i’d rather just keep elias – i don’t see prospal coming here on a one-year, and he’s 35+ and giving any one of those guys a multi-year deal is asking to regret it.

by Triumph44 on May 29, 2010 11:06 PM EDT reply actions  

The great thing about Vinny Prospal is that he has proven in the past, even just this past year, that he can be a nice complement to highly skilled players, and he only earned 1.1M on a one-year contract last year. The trouble with Prospal is that you don’t know which Vinny you’re getting. Good Vinny scored 58 pts last year (19 on the PP) and was a +8, and scored 71 points with an even rating three seasons ago on a team that landed themselves the #1 draft pick. Bad Vinny scored 45 points and was a -20 two seasons ago and scored 55 points to go along with a gaudy -24 four seasons ago. Still, a consistent 50-point scorer is nothing to scoff at – only three Devils not named Kovalchuk finished with more than 50 points (Parise, Zajac, Langenbrunner). Elias certainly would have joined that list if he had been healthy to start the season.

I agree, though, that Prospal might not leave the rangers to come to jersey. I would have no problem, though, paying him 2-2.5M for ONE year, it would be a pretty small gamble.

by dr(d)evil on May 29, 2010 11:24 PM EDT up reply actions  

Prospal also gelled with Gaborik

So he can play with big time players, like Kovy.

"Hockey is a sport for white men. Basketball is a sport for black men. Golf is a sport for white men dressed like black pimps."- Tiger Woods

by RolliePollieKovy on May 30, 2010 3:52 PM EDT up reply actions  

i generally don’t like GVT as a standalone stat because, if i’m correct about the methodology (and Tom Awad explained it on Puck Prospectus a while ago), it really doesn’t take into account year to year variance in save percentage for and against. so players will yo-yo around their ‘expected’ GVT.

I’m a little confused by the complaint? GVT is a results-based stat and only 2009-10 GVT is listed here. I’m not sure how year to year variance is supposed to be taken into account, and I’m pretty sure it doesn’t regress to a mean.

Devils in my heart! Devils in my mind! Devils in my eyes! Devils until I die!
In Lou We Trust - The New Jersey Devils SBN Blog

by John Fischer on May 29, 2010 11:29 PM EDT up reply actions  

it's not

i’m just commenting that i don’t like it as a standalone. it measures past value, sure, but i don’t think it’s particularly predictive. it is the best thing we have so far, though.

by Triumph44 on May 29, 2010 11:36 PM EDT up reply actions  

You’re right, GVT isn’t predicative. All a season GVT measures is how a player performed in a season. Not performances prior to that season, just that individual season on it’s own.

Devils in my heart! Devils in my mind! Devils in my eyes! Devils until I die!
In Lou We Trust - The New Jersey Devils SBN Blog

by John Fischer on May 29, 2010 11:42 PM EDT up reply actions  

right. and for some X% of players, that will adequately measure their value enough that we could probably predict their value next season to fall within some range Y% of the time. but then there are outliers, made more so by the small sample sizes pre/post trade – so e.g. with dominic moore, in florida, his team shot 6.0% at even strength with him on the ice, whereas in montreal, they shot 11.2%. that’s going to translate into a much higher GVT/game in montreal.

anyway, it’s a nitpicky comment.

one thing about prospal is that NYR shot 9.8% at even strength while he was on the ice – no devil has done that in a full season in the 3 years that timeonice has kept track of it.

by Triumph44 on May 30, 2010 9:56 AM EDT up reply actions  

with dominic moore, in florida, his team shot 6.0% at even strength with him on the ice, whereas in montreal, they shot 11.2%. that’s going to translate into a much higher GVT/game in montreal.

This is a good point, one I haven’t considered. Though I do bring up on-ice even strength shooting percentage in what should be today’s post, that is a good point. The reasons why could vary: Moore got “hotter,” coaching used him in a different role, the guys on the ice with him were shooting well, etc., etc.

one thing about prospal is that NYR shot 9.8% at even strength while he was on the ice – no devil has done that in a full season in the 3 years that timeonice has kept track of it.

You’re right that it’s a high Sh%, but if I can be nitpicky, I believe Clarkson surpassed that in 07-08 – though the other above-9.8 Sh% came from guys who were injured for a significant part of the season. The point is made, however.

Devils in my heart! Devils in my mind! Devils in my eyes! Devils until I die!
In Lou We Trust - The New Jersey Devils SBN Blog

by John Fischer on May 30, 2010 11:13 AM EDT up reply actions  

re: ES S% and S% against – i mean, it’s really what’s controlling what’s going on, IMO.

timeonice.com has clarkson’s on ice shooting at 9.6% for 07-08 – it’s possible that empty-net goals account for the difference. not very important.

elias did have a high on-ice ES shooting percentage, which is part of why i want to keep him at center. on-ice ES shooting percentage seems to be a reasonably sustainable skill (superstars league wide are higher than the league average – a noted exception is zach parise). the last three years, the devils have shot below league-average percentage-wise at ES and that’s not an accident – players like gionta, rolston, langenbrunner, and clarkson have all exhibited poor shot selection.

by Triumph44 on May 30, 2010 12:09 PM EDT up reply actions  

hi all, i'm new

does GVT make an adjustment for the quality of team a player is playing on? for example, is brendan morrison’s offensive GVT really a reflection of his offensive production or is it inflated because he played on an offensive machine in Washington?

by dr(d)evil on May 29, 2010 11:16 PM EDT reply actions  

No, it doesn’t adjust for quality of competition or teammates. GVT is results-based – what did the player do on their team considering their ice time, their scoring, etc. Check out Tom Awad’s explanation of GVT here and here to get a better understanding of it.

Devils in my heart! Devils in my mind! Devils in my eyes! Devils until I die!
In Lou We Trust - The New Jersey Devils SBN Blog

by John Fischer on May 29, 2010 11:33 PM EDT up reply actions  

Patrick Marleau has a 15.9 OGVT, 4.1 DGVT, and a -0.2 SGVT. Does this mean he scored 15.9 more goals than the average forward, prevented 4.1 more goals than the average forward, and hurt his team by scoring 0.2 goals less than the average forward?

On a side note, do you happen to have Jussi Jokinen’s SGVT from the 2005-06 season?

As always, a great read that very clearly explained an advanced statistic.

by Derek Leung on May 30, 2010 4:49 AM EDT reply actions  

Patrick Marleau has a 15.9 OGVT, 4.1 DGVT, and a -0.2 SGVT. Does this mean he scored 15.9 more goals than the average forward, prevented 4.1 more goals than the average forward, and hurt his team by scoring 0.2 goals less than the average forward?

I want to say yes, but I’m a little hesitant. Generally, I use the value more for comparison; but perhaps this is right too? I’ll ask Tom about it later.

On a side note, do you happen to have Jussi Jokinen’s SGVT from the 2005-06 season?

I do. Only it comes from Tom Awad’s all-time GVT list where he normalized the numbers to account for different eras and situations. So it may be a little different from the raw number. Not that it’s not ridiculously impressive. Here’s his shootout GVT throughout his career:

05-06: 4.3 (Total GVT: 11.7 – rookie season)
06-07: 0.9 (Total GVT: 10.6)
07-08: 0.6 (Total GVT: 6.9)
08-09: 0.7 (Total GVT: 1.5)
09-10: 0.9 (Total GVT: 15.8)

Jokinen’s always been an above replacement level shootout taker; but his 05-06 season was just off-the-charts amazing. Since then, he’s regressed to being OK but not especially great. I will say that he broke out in a huge way last season in Carolina (30 goals, 35 assists), so much so that I don’t think people should see Jokinen as just a shootout specialist anymore.

Devils in my heart! Devils in my mind! Devils in my eyes! Devils until I die!
In Lou We Trust - The New Jersey Devils SBN Blog

by John Fischer on May 30, 2010 11:21 AM EDT up reply actions  

Thanks for the answer. Jokinen’s 15.8 GVT is really impressive! If he was a free agent this year, he would be second to only Patrick Marleau in terms of GVT… wow!

by Derek Leung on May 30, 2010 11:29 AM EDT up reply actions  

langenbrunner

hmmmm….let us suppose…and i’m sure we could figure out…if langenbrunner’s GVT were much, much higher when he plays with zajac and parise than all of the other times and line combinations that he played with this season would that mean that he is only a great player when he plays with zajac and langenbrunner?…or that he is a below average player when he plays with everyone not named parise and langenbrunner?…if so, doesn’t this statistic say more about what team a player plays on and which line he skates on rather than the raw, basic talent of the player himself?…i’m not a big stat guy but i think this stat might be inherently flawed

by don in central jersey on May 30, 2010 12:55 PM EDT reply actions  

by the way, GREAT caption, John.

by dr(d)evil on May 30, 2010 9:28 PM EDT reply actions  

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